Host

Gretchen Steidle is the director of Garrison Institute’s Spirituality and Social Change initiative.

Guest

Norma Kawelokū Wong Roshi is a Native Hawaiian and Hakka lifelong resident of Hawaiʻi. She is an 86th generation Zen Master and abbot of Anko-in, an independent branch temple of Daihonzan Chozen-ji. She has served in politics for over 30 years and has been instrumental in negotiating land returns, revenue, and cleanup of the homelands of Native Hawaiians. She is currently part of the Collective Acceleration community of practice and has just published a new book, Who We are Becoming Matters. She also has a new podcast – The Horizon Story – on all streaming platforms.

Read and download the full transcript.

Show Notes

• [03:30] Norma Wong begins with a grounding practice, inviting listeners to arrive fully in the present moment through posture, breath, and awareness of the body.
• [05:45] What does it feel like to be human right now? Norma describes the mixture of anxiety and excitement that lets her know she is alive.
• [06:53] Growing up in Kalihi Valley, Hawaiʻi, Norma learned the importance of community, long relationships, and mutual responsibility. She reflects on how living on an island shapes our understanding of our responsibility to one another.
• [10:51] Norma describes becoming a Zen practitioner in her early 20s, at the same time she entered political life. For her, spiritual practice and civic engagement have never been separate; groundedness must extend beyond formal practice into everyday life.
• [12:28] Norma introduces the concept of kuleana—mutual responsibility and stewardship—and explores what it means to extend our sense of responsibility beyond ourselves, our immediate communities, and even our own time.
• [15:39] Considering Earth as “the ship called Mother Earth,” Norma asks who constitutes its crew. In an era of polycrisis, she argues that we must expand our awareness and senses to recognize our interconnectedness and responsibility to the world around us.
• [18:46] How can people who have become disconnected from their indigenous roots reconnect with a deeper sense of relationship and responsibility? Norma suggests that our capacity for connection is not something we need to invent, but something we can consciously reawaken and cultivate.
• [22:39] This reawakening, Norma emphasizes, is a collective endeavor. We can practice, fail, reset, and keep moving forward together rather than attempting transformation alone.
• [24:23] Norma offers simple practices for cultivating connection, including walking in nature with all our senses open and sharing food with others. These everyday experiences can help us return to a deeper relationship with the Earth and with one another.
• [30:21] From caring for a plant to preparing a meal, Norma explores how seemingly small acts of attention and cultivation can reconnect us with our humanity. She shares the story of a high-school automobile repair teacher who asked students to grow a plant before joining his class.
• [32:08] For activists, change-makers, and others facing urgent problems, Norma challenges the idea that action and inner work are competing priorities. The quality, care, and humanity we bring to our actions are part of the change itself.
• [36:34] Norma discusses the importance of pauses and regular practices of renewal. Clearing the “deck” allows us to make better decisions, conserve energy, and distinguish genuine urgency from habits of busyness.
• [39:29] Norma explores the “cul-de-sac” of systems change. While systems change can be a powerful tool, she questions whether existing systems can deliver what is needed when those systems themselves are collapsing under conditions they were not designed to address.
• [44:25] What can help us navigate a time of systemic breakdown? Norma returns to the ancient practice of community, arguing that relationships and collective possibility are essential sources of hope.
• [47:03] Using the metaphor of fishing, Norma illustrates why the challenges we face can no longer be approached as solitary endeavors. Some goals require many people, working together and in relationship, to create the conditions for collective success.
• [50:17] Norma describes Collective Acceleration as a learning community focused on becoming the people capable of creating a future of “interdependent thriving” rather than fighting to a draw. Individual transformation matters—but no one has to make that transformation alone.
• [52:42] Norma invites listeners to imagine the future they want rather than simply imagining what happens if nothing changes. Through “The Horizon Story,” people can gather together and ask: If our work succeeds, what would that world look like—and what part of that future can we begin creating now?
• [55:01] Norma shares a powerful example from a town in Maine, where ten people imagined a future in which neighbors shared food and community during a government shutdown. Over the course of a month, their effort grew to 5,300 meals and more than 100 volunteers.
• [56:34] As the conversation closes, Norma invites listeners to consider what their role might be in the “larger net” of mutual stewardship—and what they can begin doing now from that orientation.
• [57:08] Norma’s final invitation: don’t get stuck. Keep moving, keep trying, and remember that while the work is serious, we do not have to take ourselves so seriously.